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- since 1996 -
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Technical Discussions
Gregory
NDT Inspector,
Poland, Joined Feb 2012, 15

Gregory

NDT Inspector,
Poland,
Joined Feb 2012
15
12:53 Mar-15-2013
PSM-5 (TAM146040)

Hello !!!
I would like to know some details about preparing base-line on PSM-5 (TAM146040) samples.
Can somebody help me in this question

 
 Reply 
 
Tim
Tim
13:11 Mar-15-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregory at 12:53 Mar-15-2013 (Opening).

Hello Gregory,

What requirement (specification) are you working? ASTM E1417 makes reference, but details and answers to any questions can be found here.

 
 Reply 
 
Gregory
NDT Inspector,
Poland, Joined Feb 2012, 15

Gregory

NDT Inspector,
Poland,
Joined Feb 2012
15
13:36 Mar-15-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Tim at 13:11 Mar-15-2013 .

Sorry, I work with ASTM E1417. We use PSM-5 (TAM146040) in our company. I need information about establisment baseline on this sample. I know that we should establish baseline, take a reference picture, and take some liters of new unused penetrant pour to another tank and keep by year. After year we should do deterioration of the sample using new, unused penetrant. If in this period time I used to another batch no of the penetrant. Must I do new baseline and new pictures to each batch nr of pebnetrant?
You know what I meen??

 
 Reply 
 
Gregory
NDT Inspector,
Poland, Joined Feb 2012, 15

Gregory

NDT Inspector,
Poland,
Joined Feb 2012
15
14:32 Mar-15-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregory at 13:36 Mar-15-2013 .

Mr TIM are able to help me in this question?

 
 Reply 
 
Tim
Tim
14:43 Mar-15-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregory at 14:32 Mar-15-2013 .

In my opinion it is a good practice to baseline a new batch number. It may, or may not, be a specification or customer requirement.

 
 Reply 
 
Tim
Tim
14:48 Mar-15-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregory at 14:32 Mar-15-2013 .

Also, in reading your post again - you mention "deterioration of the sample".

Do you mean degradation of the panel?

 
 Reply 
 
Gregory
NDT Inspector,
Poland, Joined Feb 2012, 15

Gregory

NDT Inspector,
Poland,
Joined Feb 2012
15
15:03 Mar-15-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Tim at 14:48 Mar-15-2013 .

Yes, deterioration=degradation.
I can't find information on this subject in our customer specification and it is problem for me.
Our responsible level 3 says that it should be do, but during the audit has denied. Now I don't know anything.

 
 Reply 
 
Tim
Tim
15:48 Mar-15-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregory at 15:03 Mar-15-2013 .

Gregory,

My best advise is to follow written intructions given in your procedure as approved by your Level 3. Also, direct questions to your Level 3 if possible. Hope this helps!

Still, specific questions will find answers here.

Best of Luck!

 
 Reply 
 
Michel Couture
NDT Inspector,
consultant, Canada, Joined Sep 2006, 889

Michel Couture

NDT Inspector,
consultant,
Canada,
Joined Sep 2006
889
04:33 Mar-16-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Tim at 15:48 Mar-15-2013 .

Gregory,

The TAM panel is to verify the condition of your penentrant. So as Tim mentinned previously, you should take a picture of every time you change the penentrant in your tank. As well, you should ensure propre cleaning of your TAM panel. Dried penetrant in the "stars" will result is false indications during your test.

Peersonnally, whenever I can, I keep my penetrant in the container and pour a quantity of it into a smaller container which I will brush onto the parts. This way, I do not contaminate my penentrant and same time with quality check that I no longer have to perform. Or, I use spray cans, again this prevent contamination of my products and save time on quality check that I do not have to perform.

 
 Reply 
 
Santosh Narayan
Consultant,
Shet NDT Services, India, Joined Mar 2013, 7

Santosh Narayan

Consultant,
Shet NDT Services,
India,
Joined Mar 2013
7
06:05 Mar-16-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregory at 12:53 Mar-15-2013 (Opening).

Dear Gregory

in order to prepare base-line on PSM-5 (TAM146040) you should first process the panel with Un-Used materials when new panel is brought then measure the indication size with appropriate measuring device and note down the readings along with the 1: 1 size photograph. whenever you change the penetrant completely you have to re- establish the same. if you are just adding the penetrant just compare the panel using un-used penetrant matrials for its comparison, if you find notisable changes then you may have go with the level-3 consultation for next action to be taken. Point to remember is batch No of penetrant shall always be the batch no of new added penetrant.

After an year/according to the specification you are working for you need to re-process the panel with all Un-used materials and re-check the indication sizes for the degradation according to ASTM E 1417 the deference shall not be more than +/- 30% of first photograph.

Regards

Santosh narayan
ASNT and NAS410 Level-3 PT and MT
Bangalore

 
 Reply 
 
Gregroy
NDT Inspector,
Poland, Joined Feb 2012, 15

Gregroy

NDT Inspector,
Poland,
Joined Feb 2012
15
11:34 Mar-16-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Santosh Narayan at 06:05 Mar-16-2013 .

Hello !!!
It has confirmed with my guesses.
I have to take a base picture each if I will change the penetrant.
Must I conduct degradation check only on first batch penetrant??
It is good practice buy penetrant in big tank then we have a one batch no and we won't have to do base-line often.

 
 Reply 
 
Gregroy
NDT Inspector,
Poland, Joined Feb 2012, 15

Gregroy

NDT Inspector,
Poland,
Joined Feb 2012
15
11:43 Mar-16-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregroy at 11:34 Mar-16-2013 .

I have a one more question.
What error is permissible during calibration of manometer?
What deviation from the nominal value the manometr should show? I have mean +/_%value
Eventualy which norm I can find this informations in?

 
 Reply 
 
Santosh Narayan
Consultant,
Shet NDT Services, India, Joined Mar 2013, 7

Santosh Narayan

Consultant,
Shet NDT Services,
India,
Joined Mar 2013
7
04:35 Mar-17-2013
Re: PSM-5 (TAM146040)
In Reply to Gregroy at 11:43 Mar-16-2013 .

Dear gregory

As we work as per boeing we are using pressure gauge tolerance of +/- 5 PSI as per their standard which is accepted by other too. But for excess developer removal the pressure gauge is calibrated to 5% accuracy.

Frequency of calibration is as stated in ASTM E1417 - once in six months.

Regards

Santosh Narayan

 
 Reply 
 

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