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KARL DEUTSCH
INSTRUMENTS AND SYSTEMS FOR NON-DESTRUCTIVE TESTING OF MATERIALS
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Technical Discussions
Paulo Henrique
Paulo Henrique
03:43 Jan-08-2007
Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9

Hello,
Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectorial scan?
Thanks in advance.
Best Regards,
Paulo




 
 Reply 
 
Ed Ginzel
R & D, -
Materials Research Institute, Canada, Joined Nov 1998, 1300

Ed Ginzel

R & D, -
Materials Research Institute,
Canada,
Joined Nov 1998
1300
03:42 Jan-11-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
Paulo:
Phased Array UT can be used effectively when you can validate the sizing method. Frederic Jacques et al published a paper in Insight (Nov 2003). This showed how a tip diffraction method developed earlier in Japan was improved using Phased Arrays. You will need to ensure sufficient sensitivity to make use of the tip signals.
Under some conditions it is also possible to arrange TOFD focal laws for phased array probes.
Ed


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Hello,
: Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectorial scan?
: Thanks in advance.
: Best Regards,
: Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Gerald
Gerald
05:06 Jan-28-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
I suggest FBH, I.D. O.D. notchs,and SDH be used. A sectorial scan will do the job if it's set up properly and qualified with the above. As Paulo has already mentioned, as long as you can validate the sizing method it will work.
(suggest reading note 1 page 1 in 2235-9)

----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Paulo:
: Phased Array UT can be used effectively when you can validate the sizing method. Frederic Jacques et al published a paper in Insight (Nov 2003). This showed how a tip diffraction method developed earlier in Japan was improved using Phased Arrays. You will need to ensure sufficient sensitivity to make use of the tip signals.
: Under some conditions it is also possible to arrange TOFD focal laws for phased array probes.
: Ed
:
: : Hello,
: : Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: : My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectorial scan?
: : Thanks in advance.
: : Best Regards,
: : Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Carlos Correia
Carlos Correia
03:54 Aug-03-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
Mr Paulo
Take care with the PA images, its better to develop a merge with tomoview software. If you don have the software... take care you can oversize the discontinuity.

The images of PA differes considerably from TOFD images.


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Hello,
: Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectorial scan?
: Thanks in advance.
: Best Regards,
: Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Carlos Correia
Carlos Correia
03:57 Aug-03-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
THE ASME CODE CASE 2235 is for TOFD I BELEIVE THAT PA IS NOT INCLUDED...


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Hello,
: Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectorial scan?
: Thanks in advance.
: Best Regards,
: Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Joe Buckley
Consultant, ASNT L-III, Honorary Secretary of BINDT
Level X NDT, BINDT, United Kingdom, Joined Oct 1999, 528

Joe Buckley

Consultant, ASNT L-III, Honorary Secretary of BINDT
Level X NDT, BINDT,
United Kingdom,
Joined Oct 1999
528
00:32 Aug-03-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
That may ahve been true ofor the first issues, but later versions of the Code Case do specifically refer to PA.

-9 was the first issue to explicitly allow sizing from the Sector Scan, which has made things much easier

Joe

----------- Start Original Message -----------
: THE ASME CODE CASE 2235 is for TOFD I BELEIVE THAT PA IS NOT INCLUDED...
:
: : Hello,
: : Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: : My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectoral scan?

height measurement from phased array works pretty well, provided you understand the physics and the limitations, especially focus related issues. If its not in focus the defect will look larger (and less distinct) - just like an out of focus photograph.

: : Thanks in advance.
: : Best Regards,
: : Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Joe Buckley
Consultant, ASNT L-III, Honorary Secretary of BINDT
Level X NDT, BINDT, United Kingdom, Joined Oct 1999, 528

Joe Buckley

Consultant, ASNT L-III, Honorary Secretary of BINDT
Level X NDT, BINDT,
United Kingdom,
Joined Oct 1999
528
00:34 Aug-03-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
----------- Start Original Message -----------


That may have been true for the first issues, but later versions of the Code Case do specifically refer to PA.

2235-9 was the first issue to explicitly allow sizing from the Sector Scan, which has made things much easier

height measurement from phased array works pretty well, provided you understand the physics and the limitations, especially focus related issues. If its not in focus the defect will look larger (and less distinct) - just like an out of focus photograph.
Joe


: : THE ASME CODE CASE 2235 is for TOFD I BELEIVE THAT PA IS NOT INCLUDED...
: :
: : : Hello,
: : : Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: : : My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectoral scan?

: : : Thanks in advance.
: : : Best Regards,
: : : Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Paulo
Paulo
06:48 Aug-03-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
----------- Start Original Message -----------
:
: That may have been true for the first issues, but later versions of the Code Case do specifically refer to PA.
: 2235-9 was the first issue to explicitly allow sizing from the Sector Scan, which has made things much easier
: height measurement from phased array works pretty well, provided you understand the physics and the limitations, especially focus related issues. If its not in focus the defect will look larger (and less distinct) - just like an out of focus photograph.
: Joe
:
: : : THE ASME CODE CASE 2235 is for TOFD I BELEIVE THAT PA IS NOT INCLUDED...
: : :
: : : : Hello,
: : : : Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: : : : My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectoral scan?
: : : : Thanks in advance.
: : : : Best Regards,
: : : : Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------


Hi Joe,
How can you measure the height with Phased Array??? Using the 6dBs drop? Many times the defect are not enclosed in the beam...What is the solution in this case?? Do another scanning trying to put the beam to cover that defect or using some software device to merge the files?
Thanks!
Paulo


 
 Reply 
 
Ed Ginzel
R & D, -
Materials Research Institute, Canada, Joined Nov 1998, 1300

Ed Ginzel

R & D, -
Materials Research Institute,
Canada,
Joined Nov 1998
1300
08:52 Aug-03-2007
Re: Phased in lieu of Radiograph - CC 2235-9
Paulo:
The method of sizing (vertical extent?) for CC2235-9 needs to be qualified (demonstrated).
It states in i)(3) Flaw Sizing. Flaws shall be sized in accordance with a procedure demonstrated to size similar flaws at similar material depths. Alternatively, a flaw may be sized by a supplemental manual technique so long as it has been qualified by the demonstration above.

The beam boundary methods (e.g. -6dB or -20dB) have long been demonstarted to be grossly inaccurate. This was one ot the outcomes of the PISC studies and one of the strengths of TOFD. But with a good knowledge of UT you can also use tip diffraction of backscattered waves. A paper on this using phased arrays is found in the Nov 2003 edition of Insight by F. Moreau et al.

Ed


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: :
: : That may have been true for the first issues, but later versions of the Code Case do specifically refer to PA.
: : 2235-9 was the first issue to explicitly allow sizing from the Sector Scan, which has made things much easier
: : height measurement from phased array works pretty well, provided you understand the physics and the limitations, especially focus related issues. If its not in focus the defect will look larger (and less distinct) - just like an out of focus photograph.
: : Joe
: :
: : : : THE ASME CODE CASE 2235 is for TOFD I BELEIVE THAT PA IS NOT INCLUDED...
: : : :
: : : : : Hello,
: : : : : Please, does anybody had already tried to use Phased Array in lieu of Radiograph according to CC2235-9?
: : : : : My doubt is about the height measure. Is the height measure of Phased Array reliable? How can I do this measurement? using linear or sectoral scan?
: : : : : Thanks in advance.
: : : : : Best Regards,
: : : : : Paulo
:
: Hi Joe,
: How can you measure the height with Phased Array??? Using the 6dBs drop? Many times the defect are not enclosed in the beam...What is the solution in this case?? Do another scanning trying to put the beam to cover that defect or using some software device to merge the files?
: Thanks!
: Paulo
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 

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