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Technical Discussions
jim
jim
03:55 Feb-01-2007
MFL for pipeline

who's the best MFL pipescanner manufacture in world? i want to inspect a 6" 10mm thickness pipeline to find surface and subsurface flows


 
 Reply 
 
Rohit Bafna
,
TCR Engineering Services, India, Joined Sep 2007, 18

Rohit Bafna

,
TCR Engineering Services,
India,
Joined Sep 2007
18
02:15 Jun-01-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
We have an ongoing discussion at our office regarding the best possible NDT Technique to be applied for this assignment.

There are 13,000 pipes welded together set along 135kms. Pipes have been manufactured as per API 5L Grade B. Each pipe measures 12 meter with a 6 inch diameter and 12.5mm thickness.

Our client sees a crack like indication on the surface. They also want to check for any transverse or longitudinal cracks, including ensuring accurate measurement on the depth of the crack.

Speed of NDT technique is of prime importance. We have suggested MFL. Any comments if there is any other technique that may be even quicker than MFL.

All suggestion and advise well be most appreciated.




 
 Reply 
 
Nigel
Engineering, - Specialist services
United Kingdom, Joined Oct 2000, 1096

Nigel

Engineering, - Specialist services
United Kingdom,
Joined Oct 2000
1096
02:36 Jun-01-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
The 1st question must be is the line buried? Then is it piggable? If yes, then no inspection method can be quicker than pigging, and MFL is the standard unless there is a specific reason for another detector type.

Some queries though, who do you represent and who is your client? By which means does your client see the "crack-like indication"?

----------- Start Original Message -----------
: We have an ongoing discussion at our office regarding the best possible NDT Technique to be applied for this assignment.
: There are 13,000 pipes welded together set along 135kms. Pipes have been manufactured as per API 5L Grade B. Each pipe measures 12 meter with a 6 inch diameter and 12.5mm thickness.
: Our client sees a crack like indication on the surface. They also want to check for any transverse or longitudinal cracks, including ensuring accurate measurement on the depth of the crack.
: Speed of NDT technique is of prime importance. We have suggested MFL. Any comments if there is any other technique that may be even quicker than MFL.
: All suggestion and advise well be most appreciated.
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Godfrey Hands
Consultant,
PRI Nadcap, United Kingdom, Joined Nov 1998, 303

Godfrey Hands

Consultant,
PRI Nadcap,
United Kingdom,
Joined Nov 1998
303
02:53 Jun-01-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: We have an ongoing discussion at our office regarding the best possible NDT Technique to be applied for this assignment.
: There are 13,000 pipes welded together set along 135kms. Pipes have been manufactured as per API 5L Grade B. Each pipe measures 12 meter with a 6 inch diameter and 12.5mm thickness.
: Our client sees a crack like indication on the surface. They also want to check for any transverse or longitudinal cracks, including ensuring accurate measurement on the depth of the crack.
: Speed of NDT technique is of prime importance. We have suggested MFL. Any comments if there is any other technique that may be even quicker than MFL.
: All suggestion and advise well be most appreciated.
------------ End Original Message ------------


Hi,
You may lkike to consider Long Range Ultrasonics (LRUT) as an screening tool. This can detect corrosion and transverse cracks.
Depending on the make of LRUT instrument, defects in the order of 2% to 5% Pipe Cross sectional area are detectable.
Again depending on the make of LRUT, test ranges between 30 and 150 metres in both directions can be achieved with a single test location on above ground pipe. Under the best circumstances, a test rate in the order of several Km per day can be achieved.
These tests will highlight areas of concern for other tests to confirm, and will also highlight where no problems are.

NDT Consultants in the UK can perform these tests for you, as can other companies.

Regards,

Godfrey Hands
NDT Consultants Ltd.



 
 Reply 
 
Thomas Vogt
R & D, - -
Guided Ultrasonics Ltd, United Kingdom, Joined Apr 2007, 22

Thomas Vogt

R & D, - -
Guided Ultrasonics Ltd,
United Kingdom,
Joined Apr 2007
22
03:24 Jun-01-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
Hi,

this is a classical example for managing a large scale inspection task using GWUT, also called LRUT. It is about managing the inspection so it is cost efficient and fast. The way to do it is to screen the whole length of piping for problem areas using guided waves, and then to follow up with a secondary method at the location where problems were found.

As mentioned in a previous reply, the first question is indeed whether the pipe is buried, has any coatings, how many and what type of supports, what the general condition is etc. is because this will determine your range. The other question is the level of severity of the cracks you are looking to detect, e.g. crack length and depth. Also, a circumferential crack will be much easier to find than a longitudinal one.

Guided Ultrasonics Ltd manufactures and develops guided wave equipment. If you need more info please do not hesitate to contact me.

Regards,
Tom

----------- Start Original Message -----------
: We have an ongoing discussion at our office regarding the best possible NDT Technique to be applied for this assignment.
: There are 13,000 pipes welded together set along 135kms. Pipes have been manufactured as per API 5L Grade B. Each pipe measures 12 meter with a 6 inch diameter and 12.5mm thickness.
: Our client sees a crack like indication on the surface. They also want to check for any transverse or longitudinal cracks, including ensuring accurate measurement on the depth of the crack.
: Speed of NDT technique is of prime importance. We have suggested MFL. Any comments if there is any other technique that may be even quicker than MFL.
: All suggestion and advise well be most appreciated.
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
John O'Brien
Consultant, -
Chevron ETC , USA, Joined Jan 2000, 280

John O'Brien

Consultant, -
Chevron ETC ,
USA,
Joined Jan 2000
280
04:14 Jun-01-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
As indicated by some other responders you need to explain more about the pipeline. Have these indications been revealed during construction, is the pipeline old and have they been revealed during excavation. Is the pipeline buried, externally or internally coated.

Once you have listed all the parameters you can then work on the morphology of the flaw and the reaction to NDE.

If these flaws have developed in-service you need to think about the root cause and the anticipated progression. Are the indications in base pipe or weld areas?

Then you can start to think about appropriate NDE. On long pipelines with random flaws of a crack like nature neither MFL or Long Range UT are likley to have a high reliability. You may need to think of using an ultrasonic pig of which there are several methods including EMAT and Elastic Wave. This will be especially true of crack like flaws with transverse orientation.

Of course to use a UT pig there may be issues on whether the product is liquid or gas and how clean the lines are.

You may need to consult with the various pipeline vendors Rosen, PII, NDTSystems, Tuboscope, BJ Pipeline Services to find the best fit solution but they will need much of the data discussed here before they can provide viable solutions.


 
 Reply 
 
Rohit Bafna
,
TCR Engineering Services, India, Joined Sep 2007, 18

Rohit Bafna

,
TCR Engineering Services,
India,
Joined Sep 2007
18
04:19 Jun-01-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
Thank you everyone for your responses on this topic. I will update this thread with detailed technical requirements in the next 3 days.

In response to Nigel's statement regarding our background - We are a Material testing lab and a NDT Services company headquartered in India and have offices and labs in India, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia. This particular project is for a large oil company in Kuwait.


 
 Reply 
 
Nigel
Engineering, - Specialist services
United Kingdom, Joined Oct 2000, 1096

Nigel

Engineering, - Specialist services
United Kingdom,
Joined Oct 2000
1096
05:00 Jun-01-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
Looks like you came to the right place for information, Rohit. Weekend now so Monday will be fine - do you have Saturday/Sunday wekends in India?


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Thank you everyone for your responses on this topic. I will update this thread with detailed technical requirements in the next 3 days.
: In response to Nigel's statement regarding our background - We are a Material testing lab and a NDT Services company headquartered in India and have offices and labs in India, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia. This particular project is for a large oil company in Kuwait.
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Aravindan Balakrishnan
Aravindan Balakrishnan
09:08 Jun-02-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
We are representing NDT Consultants Ltd., UK and they are specialized in LRUT (Long Range Ultrasonic Testing) using MsS Technology.

Please contact us in the following address:
EXIM TRADING CO. LTD.,
P.O. BOX 25371,
SAFAT 13113
KUWAIT
PH: 2456557, 2441254, 2456558
FAX: 2456559
CELL: 9379966
E-mail: eximkwt@gmail.com

--------- Start Original Message -----------
: We have an ongoing discussion at our office regarding the best possible NDT Technique to be applied for this assignment.
: There are 13,000 pipes welded together set along 135kms. Pipes have been manufactured as per API 5L Grade B. Each pipe measures 12 meter with a 6 inch diameter and 12.5mm thickness.
: Our client sees a crack like indication on the surface. They also want to check for any transverse or longitudinal cracks, including ensuring accurate measurement on the depth of the crack.
: Speed of NDT technique is of prime importance. We have suggested MFL. Any comments if there is any other techniquethat may be even quicker than MFL.
: All suggestion and advise well be most appreciated.
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Rohit Bafna
,
TCR Engineering Services, India, Joined Sep 2007, 18

Rohit Bafna

,
TCR Engineering Services,
India,
Joined Sep 2007
18
05:44 Jun-02-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
I now have more technical information to share with everyone.

- The pipe is not burried
- It is piggable
- The pipes are not welded as earlier mentioned but rather lying vacant in storage in 12meter blocks. Total number of pipes when put together measures 135kms. I apologize for any confusion I might have caused here.
- The pipeline is not very old (max 1 year) and has no coatings on it.
- Severity of crack length and depth has not been determined by the end client as of date.

I thank everyone for their replies. In the past we had several discussions in our office in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia on this topic, often heated (to be read as passionate) discussions, and I thank everyone on this online community for allowing us to learn from the collective wisdom of others.

I will contact the companies mentioned by other posters and take it from there.


 
 Reply 
 
Nigel
Engineering, - Specialist services
United Kingdom, Joined Oct 2000, 1096

Nigel

Engineering, - Specialist services
United Kingdom,
Joined Oct 2000
1096
06:29 Jun-03-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
Rohit

If the pipes are not welded but stacked, then how is it piggable?


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: I now have more technical information to share with everyone.
: - The pipe is not burried
: - It is piggable
: - The pipes are not welded as earlier mentioned but rather lying vacant in storage in 12meter blocks. Total number of pipes when put together measures 135kms. I apologize for any confusion I might have caused here.
: - The pipeline is not very old (max 1 year) and has no coatings on it.
: - Severity of crack length and depth has not been determined by the end client as of date.
: I thank everyone for their replies. In the past we had several discussions in our office in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia on this topic, often heated (to be read as passionate) discussions, and I thank everyone on this online community for allowing us to learn from the collective wisdom of others.
: I will contact the companies mentioned by other posters and take it from there.
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
mani
Engineering, Inspection Engineer
Qatarpetroleum refining division, Qatar, Joined Sep 2002, 7

mani

Engineering, Inspection Engineer
Qatarpetroleum refining division,
Qatar,
Joined Sep 2002
7
06:48 Jun-03-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: I now have more technical information to share with everyone.
: - The pipe is not burried
: - It is piggable
: - The pipes are not welded as earlier mentioned but rather lying vacant in storage in 12meter blocks. Total number of pipes when put together measures 135kms. I apologize for any confusion I might have caused here.
: - The pipeline is not very old (max 1 year) and has no coatings on it.
: - Severity of crack length and depth has not been determined by the end client as of date.
: I thank everyone for their replies. In the past we had several discussions in our office in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia on this topic, often heated (to be read as passionate) discussions, and I thank everyone on this online community for allowing us to learn from the collective wisdom of others.
: I will contact the companies mentioned by other posters and take it from there.
------------ End Original Message ------------

Hello
We undersatnd you must have started the thread on the basis of the urgency and criticality of the problem in your workplace. However you could have avoided the time spent on this discussions had the actual accurate information is posted in the first time.

However if the pipes are above ground not connected together and wish to find the transverse crack still Ibelive the Long range UT method will be the fastest and reliable and can quantify


 
 Reply 
 
Rohit Bafna
,
TCR Engineering Services, India, Joined Sep 2007, 18

Rohit Bafna

,
TCR Engineering Services,
India,
Joined Sep 2007
18
09:33 Jun-03-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: : I now have more technical information to share with everyone.
: : - The pipe is not burried
: : - It is piggable
: : - The pipes are not welded as earlier mentioned but rather lying vacant in storage in 12meter blocks. Total number of pipes when put together measures 135kms. I apologize for any confusion I might have caused here.
: : - The pipeline is not very old (max 1 year) and has no coatings on it.
: : - Severity of crack length and depth has not been determined by the end client as of date.
: : I thank everyone for their replies. In the past we had several discussions in our office in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia on this topic, often heated (to be read as passionate) discussions, and I thank everyone on this online community for allowing us to learn from the collective wisdom of others.
: : I will contact the companies mentioned by other posters and take it from there.
: Hello
: We undersatnd you must have started the thread on the basis of the urgency and criticality of the problem in your workplace. However you could have avoided the time spent on this discussions had the actual accurate information is posted in the first time.
: However if the pipes are above ground not connected together and wish to find the transverse crack still Ibelive the Long range UT method will be the fastest and reliable and can quantify
------------ End Original Message ------------

I started this thread not not shear urgency but becuase we had conflicting schools of thought to solve the problem. Some sujggested IRIS, others said MFL and some said to use LRUT as a screening tool. Since the pipes were only 12meters long, we thought LRUT may be an expensive solution.

Nigel: The pipe can be acessed from inside.

Thanks everyone for your time on this subject. Through your various responses, we have found possible solutions routes. Thanks to those who send me direct emails and I will contact your respective companies.


 
 Reply 
 
A.Voge
A.Voge
07:40 Jun-04-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: : : I now have more technical information to share with everyone.
: : : - The pipe is not burried
: : : - It is piggable
: : : - The pipes are not welded as earlier mentioned but rather lying vacant in storage in 12meter blocks. Total number of pipes when put together measures 135kms. I apologize for any confusion I might have caused here.
: : : - The pipeline is not very old (max 1 year) and has no coatings on it.
: : : - Severity of crack length and depth has not been determined by the end client as of date.
: : : I thank everyone for their replies. In the past we had several discussions in our office in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia on this topic, often heated (to be read as passionate) discussions, and I thank everyone on this online community for allowing us to learn from the collective wisdom of others.
: : : I will contact the companies mentioned by other posters and take it from there.
: : Hello
: : We undersatnd you must have started the thread on the basis of the urgency and criticality of the problem in your workplace. However you could have avoided the time spent on this discussions had the actual accurate information is posted in the first time.
: : However if the pipes are above ground not connected together and wish to find the transverse crack still Ibelive the Long range UT method will be the fastest and reliable and can quantify
: I started this thread not not shear urgency but becuase we had conflicting schools of thought to solve the problem. Some sujggested IRIS, others said MFL and some said to use LRUT as a screening tool. Since the pipes were only 12meters long, we thought LRUT may be an expensive solution.
: Nigel: The pipe can be acessed from inside.
: Thanks everyone for your time on this subject. Through your various responses, we have found possible solutions routes. Thanks to those who send me direct emails and I will contact your respective companies.
------------ End Original Message ------------
I hope you didn't mistaken small seams and overlap for cracks.Anyway linepipe should be inspected to API standard 5L or same other standard. Depending with standard was used there are different acceptance criteria .Before starting discussing what kind inspection should be performed you should find out from the paper the history of inspection and what the orignial acceptance criteria were.

Regards
Andreas Voge



 
 Reply 
 
John O'Brien
Consultant, -
Chevron ETC , USA, Joined Jan 2000, 280

John O'Brien

Consultant, -
Chevron ETC ,
USA,
Joined Jan 2000
280
05:00 Jun-04-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
The information is getting better. the outstanding question is is this new pipe always in stock or reclaimed pipe i.e. it has been used at some time.

These questions go directly to the flaw morphology.

On new pipe you need to look at the orginal purchase specifications and examination requirements accept/reject criterias etc. You do see indications even on new pipe that people get concerned about (cold sizing etc) that have been and are acaceptable by mill specifications.

If the pipe is reclaimed which it appears not to be the case here then other flaws may have appeared.

Drawing a pig through 12 metre lengths is an option. Tuboscope did an external MFL on reclaimed pipe in Oman a number of years ago that was very successful. A number of companies AGR, Mechanical Integrity etc have internal multiple probe arrays that can be drawn through pipes. EMATs have also been successfully applied externally.

With alarge amount of pipe the issues on pipe handling are often more significant. OCTG inspection companies like Tuboscope are often set up for these types of inspections.


 
 Reply 
 
Thomas Vogt
R & D, - -
Guided Ultrasonics Ltd, United Kingdom, Joined Apr 2007, 22

Thomas Vogt

R & D, - -
Guided Ultrasonics Ltd,
United Kingdom,
Joined Apr 2007
22
01:33 Jun-04-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
Hi

this is why I prefer the term GWUT (guided wave UT) rather than LRUT because guided waves does not only apply to long range applications.

Regarding the cost: Having all the pipes in stock and readily accessible, all with the same setup, I suppose on simple supports only, the test will only take about 5 minutes for each pipe section.

In any case, details about the cracklike indications will influence a decision on how to proceed.

Regards,
Tom

----------- Start Original Message -----------
: : : I now have more technical information to share with everyone.
: : : - The pipe is not burried
: : : - It is piggable
: : : - The pipes are not welded as earlier mentioned but rather lying vacant in storage in 12meter blocks. Total number of pipes when put together measures 135kms. I apologize for any confusion I might have caused here.
: : : - The pipeline is not very old (max 1 year) and has no coatings on it.
: : : - Severity of crack length and depth has not been determined by theend client as of date.
: : : I thank everyone for their replies. In the past we had several discussions in our office in Kuwait and Saudi Arabia on this topic, often heated (to be read as passionate) discussions, and I thank everyone on this online community for allowing us to learn from the collective wisdom of others.
: : : I will contact the companies mentioned by other posters and take it from there.
: : Hello
: : We undersatnd you must have started the thread on the basis of the urgency and criticality of the problem in your workplace. However you could have avoided the time spent on this discussions had the actual accurate information is posted in the first time.
: : However if the pipes are above ground not connected together and wish to find the transverse crack still Ibelive the Long range UT method will be the fastest and reliable and can quantify
: I started this thread not not shear urgency but becuase we had conflicting schools of thought to solve the problem. Some sujggested IRIS, others said MFL and some said to use LRUT as a screening tool. Since the pipes were only 12meters long, we thought LRUT may be an expensive solution.
: Nigel: The pipe can be acessed from inside.
: Thanks everyone for your time on this subject. Through your various responses, we have found possible solutions routes. Thanks to those who send me direct emails and I will contact your respective companies.
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
 Reply 
 
Godfrey Hands
Consultant,
PRI Nadcap, United Kingdom, Joined Nov 1998, 303

Godfrey Hands

Consultant,
PRI Nadcap,
United Kingdom,
Joined Nov 1998
303
01:45 Jun-06-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: We have an ongoing discussion at our office regarding the best possible NDT Technique to be applied for this assignment.
: There are 13,000 pipes welded together set along 135kms. Pipes have been manufactured as per API 5L Grade B. Each pipe measures 12 meter with a 6 inch diameter and 12.5mm thickness.
: Our client sees a crack like indication on the surface. They also want to check for any transverse or longitudinal cracks, including ensuring accurate measurement on the depth of the crack.
: Speed of NDT technique is of prime importance. We have suggested MFL. Any comments if there is any other technique that may be even quicker than MFL.
: All suggestion and advise well be most appreciated.
------------ End Original Message ------------


Just a thought.
With the amount of pipe concerned, perhaps it could all be shipped to a pipe manufacturer who has an automated inspection facility (with either MFL or Ultrasonics) and be processed through their plant.
This is in excess of 11,000 pipe lengths.

Regards,

Godfrey Hands



 
 Reply 
 
A.Voge
A.Voge
03:39 Jun-07-2007
Re: MFL for pipeline

Instead of shipping pipes somewhere utilise an EMI unit ,this is a unit use MFL technic for longt.&transv. defects ,wallthickness measurement. This unit are mobil and would be no problem to sent a unit there for inspection.
Normal inspection speed of this units are 18-21 m/min.
May contact Tuboscope in the country and may the can help you with further infos.

Regards
Andreas Voge




 
 Reply 
 

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