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- since 1996 -

KARL DEUTSCH
INSTRUMENTS AND SYSTEMS FOR NON-DESTRUCTIVE TESTING OF MATERIALS.
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Technical Discussions
Bahram Hosseini
Director,
IQSecc, Iran, Joined Oct 2002, 4

Bahram Hosseini

Director,
IQSecc,
Iran,
Joined Oct 2002
4
00:34 Jul-10-2007
Root Pass Evaluation S.S. Pipes

Hi everybody,

Is there any NDT method (or idea) for evaluation of the root pass of austenitic stainless steel pipes which are suspected to use of the wrong electrode (i.e. E6010)?
The thickness range is from 5 to 20 mm. with variable diameter.

Regards,


B. Hosseini



    
 
 Reply 
 
Ryan Burns
Ryan Burns
03:30 Jul-10-2007
Re: Root Pass Evaluation S.S. Pipes
If weld prep angle allows, use of a XRF (Positive Material Analysis ie Niton) unit should work. For thickness closer to the 5mm mark, a smaller than standard head would likely have to be used. If you truly suspect E6010 was used (or another ferromagnetic rod) why not just use a small magnet?

Regards

Ryan.


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Hi everybody,
: Is there any NDT method (or idea) for evaluation of the root pass of austenitic stainless steel pipes which are suspected to use of the wrong electrode (i.e. E6010)?
: The thickness range is from 5 to 20 mm. with variable diameter.
: Regards,
:
: B. Hosseini
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 Reply 
 
Ryan Burns
Ryan Burns
05:14 Jul-11-2007
Re: Root Pass Evaluation S.S. Pipes
My preceding remarks are assuming just root pass is welded. If fill and cap are complete as well, then I am not sure. I found someone else with a similar problem, the thread can be viewed here.

Ryan.

----------- Start Original Message -----------
: If weld prep angle allows, use of a XRF (Positive Material Analysis ie Niton) unit should work. For thickness closer to the 5mm mark, a smaller than standard head would likely have to be used. If you truly suspect E6010 was used (or another ferromagnetic rod) why not just use a small magnet?
: Regards
: Ryan.
:
: : Hi everybody,
: : Is there any NDT method (or idea) for evaluation of the root pass of austenitic stainless steel pipes which are suspected to use of the wrong electrode (i.e. E6010)?
: : The thickness range is from 5 to 20 mm. with variable diameter.
: : Regards,
: :
: : B. Hosseini
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 Reply 
 
Ryan Burns
Ryan Burns
05:17 Jul-11-2007
Re: Root Pass Evaluation S.S. Pipes
http://www.aws.org/cgi-bin/mwf/topic_show.pl?pid=65571;hl=


----------- Start Original Message -----------
: My preceding remarks are assuming just root pass is welded. If fill and cap are complete as well, then I am not sure. I found someone else with a similar problem, the thread can be viewed here.
: Ryan.
: : If weld prep angle allows, use of a XRF (Positive Material Analysis ie Niton) unit should work. For thickness closer to the 5mm mark, a smaller than standard head would likely have to be used. If you truly suspect E6010 was used (or another ferromagnetic rod) why not just use a small magnet?
: : Regards
: : Ryan.
: :
: : : Hi everybody,
: : : Is there any NDT method (or idea) for evaluation of the root pass of austenitic stainless steel pipes which are suspected to use of the wrong electrode (i.e. E6010)?
: : : The thickness range is from 5 to 20 mm. with variable diameter.
: : : Regards,
: : :
: : : B. Hosseini
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 Reply 
 
Godfrey Hands
Consultant,
PRI Nadcap, United Kingdom, Joined Nov 1998, 301

Godfrey Hands

Consultant,
PRI Nadcap,
United Kingdom,
Joined Nov 1998
301
08:43 Jul-11-2007
Re: Root Pass Evaluation S.S. Pipes
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Hi everybody,
: Is there any NDT method (or idea) for evaluation of the root pass of austenitic stainless steel pipes which are suspected to use of the wrong electrode (i.e. E6010)?
: The thickness range is from 5 to 20 mm. with variable diameter.
: Regards,
:
: B. Hosseini
------------ End Original Message ------------
Hi Barham (and Ryan).
I have come accross this problem a couple of times in the past, and we have been able to get a satisfactory solution.

Let us assume that the problem is caused mostly on closer welds and repairs where it is difficult for the welder to purde the line before welding.
If you can agree with this, then you only have these welds to inspect, otherwise its probably a 100% inspection regime.

We used (electro)magnetic methods as follows:
For thicknesses below 5.5 mm we used a hand held small magnet. test pieces needed to calibrate against.

For thicknesses between 5mm and about 11mm we used a permeability meter (Forster sell one but it is very expensive. Other companies also sell them for much less money). Again calibration pieces needed.

For thicknesses above 11 mm we used a multi-frequency eddy current instrument (in our cases we used IBG Eddyliner with 25mm diameter probe, which tests simultaneously at up to 8 frequencies. Frome memory, frequencies around 150 Hz seemed to work best, but other frequencies also contribute to the result).
Again calibration pieces are needed.

Please note. Depending on the pipe orientation (horizontal or vertical pipe), there will be different amounts of free ferrite in the weld from the heating effect of the welding. This is also true for repairs where extra heat has been introduced, so free ferrite in the weld will be higher.
Also if the weld is TIG root and stick filled, this will be different to TIG root and TIG fill and cap.

Looks like you have a major job on your hands.

Success.

Regards,

Godfrey Hands




    
 
 Reply 
 
B. Hosseini
Director,
IQSecc, Iran, Joined Oct 2002, 4

B. Hosseini

Director,
IQSecc,
Iran,
Joined Oct 2002
4
00:40 Jul-11-2007
Re: Root Pass Evaluation S.S. Pipes
Hi Ryan.
for using the magnet, there is no access to pipes inside, all Tie-in welds have already done.

B. Hosseini
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: If weld prep angle allows, use of a XRF (Positive Material Analysis ie Niton) unit should work. For thickness closer to the 5mm mark, a smaller than standard head would likely have to be used. If you truly suspect E6010 was used (or another ferromagnetic rod) why not just use a small magnet?
: Regards
: Ryan.
:
: : Hi everybody,
: : Is there any NDT method (or idea) for evaluation of the root pass of austenitic stainless steel pipes which are suspected to use of the wrong electrode (i.e. E6010)?
: : The thickness range is from 5 to 20 mm. with variable diameter.
: : Regards,
: :
: : B. Hosseini
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 Reply 
 
Ingo Becker
Engineering, NDT Inspector & Sales
ec-works GmbH, Germany, Joined Apr 2000, 29

Ingo Becker

Engineering, NDT Inspector & Sales
ec-works GmbH,
Germany,
Joined Apr 2000
29
08:57 Jul-12-2007
Re: Root Pass Evaluation S.S. Pipes
It should also work with the use of eddy current. The electrical conductivities of the different electrode materials are different, and the eddy current method requires these conductivity differences. We have done exactly these inspection or search task several times. Please contact me for detailed information.

Best regards

Ingo Becker

----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Hi everybody,
: Is there any NDT method (or idea) for evaluation of the root pass of austenitic stainless steel pipes which are suspected to use of the wrong electrode (i.e. E6010)?
: The thickness range is from 5 to 20 mm. with variable diameter.
: Regards,
:
: B. Hosseini
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 Reply 
 

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