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We provide Precision, Quality, Reliability and Productivity in manufacturing processes among our knowledge of Inspection and measurement technologies

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Technical Discussions
John O'Brien
Consultant, -
Chevron ETC , USA, Joined Jan 2000, 278

John O'Brien

Consultant, -
Chevron ETC ,
USA,
Joined Jan 2000
278
03:18 Apr-13-2008
Area Of Interest In A Radiograph

Here is a challenge to the community. Many codes and standards use the term 'area of interest' when talkng about radiographic interpretation. I am guilty having spent most of the last 30 years using it. However here is the challenge 'none of the codes and standards define it'. So in weld examination where does 'area of interest' stop and start. I have always been of the opinion it is not defined so you use the dictionary definitions for 'area' and 'interest' so it is anywhere in the radiograph you want to see something. Based on this approach it makes sense the codes do not define it as they cannot forsee all situations. Try as much as I can, I cannot find a written published text that clearly defines it. Does anyone know of a published text (preferably a code) and can provide the reference.


    
 
 
Navita Gupta
Director
Satyakiran School of NDT, India, Joined Mar 2008, 3

Navita Gupta

Director
Satyakiran School of NDT,
India,
Joined Mar 2008
3
09:24 Apr-14-2008
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
Area of interest in a weld is the weld and HAZ area defined as 10% of the weld width in many standards.
Regards
Navita
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Here is a challenge to the community. Many codes and standards use the term 'area of interest' when talkng about radiographic interpretation. I am guilty having spent most of the last 30 years using it. However here is the challenge 'none of the codes and standards define it'. So in weld examination where does 'area of interest' stop and start. I have always been of the opinion it is not defined so you use the dictionary definitions for 'area' and 'interest' so it is anywhere in the radiograph you want to see something. Based on this approach it makes sense the codes do not define it as they cannot forsee all situations. Try as much as I can, I cannot find a written published text that clearly defines it. Does anyone know of a published text (preferably a code) and can provide the reference.
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 
Ed T.
Ed T.
09:50 Apr-14-2008
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph

Which standards state that? I have heard 1" or 1 t, but that was in a specific project spec not in a code.
----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Area of interest in a weld is the weld and HAZ area defined as 10% of the weld width in many standards.
: Regards
: Navita
: : Here is a challenge to the community. Many codes and standards use the term 'area of interest' when talkng about radiographic interpretation. I am guilty having spent most of the last 30 years using it. However here is the challenge 'none of the codes and standards define it'. So in weld examination where does 'area of interest' stop and start. I have always been of the opinion it is not defined so you use the dictionary definitions for 'area' and 'interest' so it is anywhere in the radiograph you want to see something. Based on this approach it makes sense the codes do not define it as they cannot forsee all situations. Try as much as I can, I cannot find a written published text that clearly defines it. Does anyone know of a published text (preferably a code) and can provide the reference.
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 
Ed T.
Ed T.
07:33 Apr-14-2008
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
Actually I believe if you are working to ASME Section XI for nuclear work it states either 1t or 1/4t depending on the method of examination (Volumetric or surface) and/or the Edition. But that's only for nuclear applications.
----------- Start Original Message -----------
:
: Which standards state that? I have heard 1" or 1 t, but that was in a specific project spec not in a code.
: : Area of interest in a weld is the weld and HAZ area defined as 10% of the weld width in many standards.
: : Regards
: : Navita
: : : Here is a challenge to the community. Many codes and standards use the term 'area of interest' when talkng about radiographic interpretation. I am guilty having spent most of the last 30 years using it. However here is the challenge 'none of the codes and standards define it'. So in weld examination where does 'area of interest' stop and start. I have always been of the opinion it is not defined so you use the dictionary definitions for 'area' and 'interest' so it is anywhere in the radiograph you want to see something. Based on this approach it makes sense the codes do not define it as they cannot forsee all situations. Try as much as I can, I cannot find a written published text that clearly defines it. Does anyone know of a published text (preferably a code) and can provide the reference.
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 
Martyn
Martyn
08:39 Apr-16-2008
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
ASTM E-1316 06A defines it as:
the specific portion of the object on the radiograph that is to be evaluated.
Ergo, if you need to evaluate anything on a given radiograph, it is by nature within the area. Clear as mud.


---------- Start Original Message -----------
: Actually I believe if you are working to ASME Section XI for nuclear work it states either 1t or 1/4t depending on the method of examination (Volumetric or surface) and/or the Edition. But that's only for nuclear applications.
: :
: : Which standards state that? I have heard 1" or 1 t, but that was in a specific project spec not in a code.
: : : Area of interest in a weld is the weld and HAZ area defined as 10% of the weld width in many standards.
: : : Regards
: : : Navita
: : : : Here is a challenge to the community. Many codes and standards use the term 'area of interest' when talkng about radiographic interpretation. I am guilty having spent most of the last 30 years using it. However here is the challenge 'none of the codes and standards define it'. So in weld examination where does 'area of interest' stop and start. I have always been of the opinion it is not defined so you use the dictionary definitions for 'area' and 'interest' so it is anywhere in the radiograph you want to see something. Based on this approach it makes sense the codes do not define it as they cannot forsee all situations. Try as much as I can, I cannot find a written published text that clearly defines it. Does anyone know of a published text (preferably a code) and can provide the reference.
------------ End Original Message ------------




    
 
 
tj
tj
01:30 May-28-2008
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
----------- Start Original Message -----------
:
: Which standards state that? I have heard 1" or 1 t, but that was in a specific project spec not in a code.
: : Area of interest in a weld is the weld and HAZ area defined as 10% of the weld width in many standards.
: : Regards
: : Navita
: : : Here is a challenge to the community. Many codes and standards use the term 'area of interest' when talkng about radiographic interpretation. I am guilty having spent most of the last 30 years using it. However here is the challenge 'none of the codes and standards define it'. So in weld examination where does 'area of interest' stop and start. I have always been of the opinion it is not defined so you use the dictionary definitions for 'area' and 'interest' so it is anywhere in the radiograph you want to see something. Based on this approach it makes sense the codes do not define it as they cannot forsee all situations. Try as much as I can, I cannot find a written published text that clearly defines it. Does anyone know of a published text (preferably a code) and can provide the reference.
------------ End Original Message ------------

Area of interest = Entire weld volume and Heat Affected Zone (the portion which is allowed per piece of film)



    
 
 
Tom Burke
Tom Burke
22:03 Jan-12-2018
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
In Reply to John O'Brien at 03:18 Apr-13-2008 (Opening).

ARTICLE 30
TERMINOLOGY FOR NONDESTRUCTIVE EXAMINATIONS STANDARD
SE-1316
ASTM E 1316 -91b

    
 
 
Tom Burke
Tom Burke
22:10 Jan-12-2018
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
In Reply to Tom Burke at 22:03 Jan-12-2018 .

location marker - a number or letter made of lead (Pb) or other highly radiation attenuative material that is placed on an object to provide traceability between a SPECIFIC AREA on the image and the part

area of interest - the SPECIFIC PORTION of the object image on the radiograph that is to be evaluated

    
 
 
Monty Wiggins
Monty Wiggins
16:25 Feb-20-2018
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
In Reply to Navita Gupta at 09:24 Apr-14-2008 .

If the HAZ is considered the "Area of Interest" in a radiograph, how can the requirements of the density variations be met per ASME Section V between the weld, IQI and the base material? In most cases the base material would not fall within those limitations, without putting a separate IQI for the base material, which is never done in most cases concerning weld radiography. This is where the "Area of Interest" gets tricky concerning weld radiographs. I would love to hear other people's take on this???

    
 
 
Tom Burke
Tom Burke
14:35 Feb-21-2018
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
In Reply to Monty Wiggins at 16:25 Feb-20-2018 .

The densities of the weld and the HAZ can easily be met by placing the 2T in the weld.
As stated in the code for IQI placement:
1. In The Weld
2. Adjacent To The Weld
and if these cannot be met
3. On A Separate Block
The reason that #1 is rarely used is that the customer prefers not to have the penny in the weld as the 2T can be confused with porosity. But, the customer prefers to see 4 or 5 wires, even after stress, which could mask a transverse crack.
Yes, I agree - more often than not, too much attention is paid to the quality of the radiograph by the interpreter (especially if there may be a repair) instead of the quality of the weld. Nit picking the quality of the radiograph never seems to make a bad weld good, unless the reshot inevitably removes the defect, resulting in good percentages with no repairs.
It is manually developed film we are talking about and not CR or DR, correct?

    
 
 
Shane Feder
, Quality Co-ordinator (SubSea)
Thailand, Joined Dec 2014, 80

Shane Feder

, Quality Co-ordinator (SubSea)
Thailand,
Joined Dec 2014
80
10:22 Feb-23-2018
Re: Area Of Interest In A Radiograph
In Reply to Monty Wiggins at 16:25 Feb-20-2018 .

Monty,
This is my take on the subject.
The weld is what is under investigation - not the parent metal so unless mandated by a specific code the HAZ should not get any special treatment.
However, anything showing sufficient density anywhere on the radiograph needs to be evaluated and reported.

This is my interpretation of "Area of Interest" - I may be totally wrong but it is only my opinion.
Place lead markers 0 & 1 on either end of a weld on a plate, place the IQI (I have only ever used wire so that is my example here) as close to the 0 or 1 as possible (with smallest wire to the outside) as that location is considered the "extremity" of the radiograph.
If the density & sensitivity are considered acceptable on the extremities of the radiograph then all within that are area are deemed acceptable by default.
That to me is the "Area of Interest"

    
 
 

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