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Technical Discussions
Frederick E. Raco, Jr.
Consultant, Partner in NDT Laboratory
RNDT, Inc., USA, Joined Jul 2002, 24

Frederick E. Raco, Jr.

Consultant, Partner in NDT Laboratory
RNDT, Inc.,
USA,
Joined Jul 2002
24
01:53 Dec-09-2002
ACCP Grandfathering

I have sat back and read each and every posting relating to the ASNT ACCP grandfathering program. I was in a conversation recently at a certain technical society meeting and the opinions of some, who are narrow-minded, have prompted me to make the following statement.

I have to disagree with all the bashing going on in our industry about the ACCP grandfathering program. We all know that there is always the possibility of people getting certifications that don't how to perform properly, both in-house and third party. I have been in the field for over twenty years working my way up the certification ladder from trainee to ASNT NDT Level III credentials in six methods plus CWI & API-510 certifications. I have applied for both the ACCP and EN-473 Level III credentials. I will be proud to hang them both on my office wall when I receive them. I earned them despite what some of you think. I have the training, experience and credentials to meet the requirements and I resent the fact that there are so many people out there saying that all grandfathered ACCP Professional Level IIIs will be considered "not worthy". I think it is a great opportunity for qualified individuals and the Society. Please don't put us all in the same basket.
Respectfully,
Frederick E. Raco, Jr.
President
RNDT, Inc. Nondestructive Testing Services
Johnstown, PA, USA




    
 
 
William Cook
Director
CITS Services Sdn. Bhd., Malaysia, Joined Jan 2002, 2

William Cook

Director
CITS Services Sdn. Bhd.,
Malaysia,
Joined Jan 2002
2
04:37 Dec-09-2002
Re: ACCP Grandfathering

: I have to disagree with all the bashing going on in our industry about the ACCP grandfathering program. We all know that there is always the possibility of people getting certifications that don't how to perform properly, both in-house and third party. I have been in the field for over twenty years working my way up the certification ladder from trainee to ASNT NDT Level III credentials in six methods plus CWI & API-510 certifications. I have applied for both the ACCP and EN-473 Level III credentials. I will be proud to hang them both on my office wall when I receive them. I earned them despite what some of you think. I have the training, experience and credentials to meet the requirements and I resent the fact that there are so many people out there saying that all grandfathered ACCP Professional Level IIIs will be considered "not worthy". I think it is a great opportunity for qualified individuals and the Society. Please don't put us all in the same basket.
: Respectfully,
: Frederick E. Raco, Jr.
: President
: RNDT, Inc. Nondestructive Testing Services
: Johnstown, PA, USA

Great, you worked your way up the ladder from trainee up to Level III. Therefore IMHO, that makes you qualified to be an ACCP Level III. BUT, what about all the Level III's that HAVE NEVER TURNED ON A SCOPE OR CRANKED OUT A SOURCE??? And, there damn sure are a lot of those runniing around. Also, what about the deal that you had to be an ASNT Level III for three years to get the ACCP via grandfathering. What is magic about having a number for 3 years? If ASNT had said that you had to show that you had been certified by some employer in the past for the method sought, then grandfather, I would find that reasonable. BTW, I have been in the field for 44 years. Level III by Automation industries 21 years ago, API tank inspector, CSWIP Senior welding inspector for 10 years, a API quality auditor etc. Yet, I don't qualify to be grandfathered. But, someone who has been through like a school in India that churns out Level III', can be granted ACCP. That is wrong and degrads from the ACCP's that "paid their dues" the hard way to get it.
In my opinion, the ACCP level III is the only "True" level III in that he/she is a "Super Level II"



    
 
 
David Davies
David Davies
06:48 Dec-09-2002
Re: ACCP Grandfathering
I have read your comments with interest. I am a "basher" who wants to put professional esteem before commercial considerations. I have been in NDT since 1964 and every qualification I have, I earned and worked for.
Apart from filling ASNT's coffers and rescuing a failing scheme, I do not see the rationale behind grandfathering. I agree with William Cook on the factory farmed Level III, These people often sell themselves cheap and do what they are told instead of standing up for integrity (often because they don't know any better). This depresses the value of the NDT industry. We all know of companies only paying lip service to industry standards. Quality companies have to compete in the same field with attendant higher costs.
When there is a failure we are all tarred with the same brush, and don't the media love headlines highlighting inspection failures. In five years everyone will forget about the grandfathering and all will be considered the same.
I did have hopes for ACCP, with it's practicalcontent, weeding out most of the bookworms. Unfortunately it seems apathy has allowed them to go for grandfathering. No doubt there will be a little industry with them all vouching for each other.
I don't believe that all grandfathered ACCP's are not worthy, I will apply because I have the necessary practical experience and can hold my head up proudly and say I am worthy. I do, however, have reservations about some of the potential holders once again downgrading the industry in it's attempts to reward competence.

Sorry to go on a little but I feel very strongly about the state of certification under the ASNT scheme. I feel that if many of the major users looked at ASNT in regard to their requirements they would not be happy to see ACCP being sold out. And, yes, it is these users that have failed to support and promote ACCP. Surely something the ASNT board should devote their energies to??.



    
 
 
David Davies
David Davies
00:40 Dec-09-2002
Re: ACCP Grandfathering
Sorry to post two in one day but I just found this.

Regarding ACCP grandfathering, see what our Canadian cousins think.


http://www.cinde.ca/industry.shtml

http://www.cinde.ca/MOU-Letter.pdf


For discussions see their bulletin board at

http://www.cinde.ca/cgi-bin/bb/YaBB.cgi?board=QandA;action=display;num=1032955441

They have the courage to refuse this downgrade, maybe ASNT should now withdraw the grandfathering process.




    
 
 
Daniel Hieronymus
NDT Inspector, Level II QC/QA Inspector
Contractor Short/Long Term, USA, Joined Oct 1999, 5

Daniel Hieronymus

NDT Inspector, Level II QC/QA Inspector
Contractor Short/Long Term,
USA,
Joined Oct 1999
5
06:27 Dec-09-2002
Re: ACCP Grandfathering
:I am the Chairman For the Susquehanna Valley Section,PA/ASNT. We had the "ASNT Chairman","Steve Black" over Last Month for our monthly meeting. ASNT Grandfathering was the very Topic of our meeting!
I am a level II in 6 methods under Various certifiers, so this is pretty Important information. The push for The ACCP is coming from Europe. The Demand is for Traceability(ISO 9712).The grandfathering has been embraced by the europeans and If we want to sell our goods and services to europe we need to share this common certification. So eventually we will all be covered and the original Level II/III will go away. You want and Need more Information GO! go to www.asnt.org it can answer all your questions.Or go the next ASNT section meeting in your area.



: : I have to disagree with all the bashing going on in our industry about the ACCP grandfathering program. We all know that there is always the possibility of people getting certifications that don't how to perform properly, both in-house and thirdparty. I have been in the field for over twenty years working my way up the certification ladder from trainee to ASNT NDT Level III credentials in six methods plus CWI & API-510 certifications. I have applied for both the ACCP and EN-473 Level III credentials. I will be proud to hang them both on my office wall when I receive them. I earned them despite what some of you think. I have the training, experience and credentials to meet the requirements and I resent the fact that there are so many people out there saying that all grandfathered ACCP Professional Level IIIs will be considered "not worthy". I think it is a great opportunity for qualified individuals and the Society. Please don't put us all in the same basket.
: : Respectfully,
: : Frederick E. Raco, Jr.
: : President
: : RNDT, Inc. Nondestructive Testing Services
: : Johnstown, PA, USA
.
: Great, you worked your way up the ladder from trainee up to Level III. Therefore IMHO, that makes you qualified to be an ACCP Level III. BUT, what about all the Level III's that HAVE NEVER TURNED ON A SCOPE OR CRANKED OUT A SOURCE??? And, there damn sure are a lot of those runniing around. Also, what about the deal that you had to be an ASNT Level III for three years to get the ACCP via grandfathering. What is magic about having a number for 3 years? If ASNT had said that you had to show that you had been certified by some employer in the past for the method sought, then grandfather, I would find that reasonable. BTW, I have been in the field for 44 years. Level III by Automation industries 21 years ago, API tank inspector, CSWIP Senior welding inspector for 10 years, a API quality auditor etc. Yet, I don't qualify to be grandfathered. But, someone who has been through like a school in India that churns out Level III', can be granted ACCP. That is wrong and degrads from the ACCP's that "paid their dues" the hard way to get it.
: In my opinion, the ACCP level III is the only "True" level III in that he/she is a "Super Level II"
.



    
 
 

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