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Airstar Inc.
Application of the newest technologies, such as air-coupled ultrasound, digital instrumentation, signal processing, and transducer technology.

10897 views
07:17 Apr-23-2003
Sonya Fedoruk
Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings

Does anyone know where I could obtain a UT procedure for babbit bearings? Or does anyone know for certain whether the readings are taken from the ID or the OD? I'm having a debate with a coworker on the proper procedure. Any help is appreciated.


 
07:39 Apr-23-2003
Csaba Hollo
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings Sonya,
I am assuming you are inspecting for babbit to shell disbonding. There is a specification that exists called ISO 4386 and can be obtained from the ISO website. I prefer to use the phase-reversal method using a garden variety A-Scan instrument which requires the scanning be done from the babbit face, or ID surface of the bearing. IMHO, this method is superior to that outlined in ISO 4386. Contact me via e-mail if you require details.
Csaba

: Does anyone know where I could obtain a UT procedure for babbit bearings? Or does anyone know for certain whether the readings are taken from the ID or the OD? I'm having a debate with a coworker on the proper procedure. Any help is appreciated.
.



 
01:42 Apr-26-2003

Massimo Carminati

Consultant, AUT specialist
IMG Ultrasuoni Srl,
Italy,
Joined Apr 2007
688
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings What is the material?
Is it cylindrical?



 
05:23 Apr-30-2003

Dan Hieronymus

NDT Inspector, Level II QC/QA Inspector
Contractor Short/Long Term,
USA,
Joined Oct 1999
5
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings Hello, I just recently performed a babbit UT inspection, It was performed on the ID, The surface was Flatter and the opposite was gray cast Iron. What material velocity were you planning to start with? I started with a "Lead" velocity. After aset-up with our Lead (Locally made) Standard,I scanned the Bearing with overlapping passes(longitudinal), I Didn't find any voids to report. What was the size of your bearing?
Drop me a line at inspection58@hotmail.com


: Sonya,
: I am assuming you are inspecting for babbit to shell disbonding. There is a specification that exists called ISO 4386 and can be obtained from the ISO website. I prefer to use the phase-reversal method using a garden variety A-Scan instrument which requires the scanning be done from the babbit face, or ID surface of the bearing. IMHO, this method is superior to that outlined in ISO 4386. Contact me via e-mail if you require details.
: Csaba
.
: : Does anyone know where I could obtain a UT procedure for babbit bearings? Or does anyone know for certain whether the readings are taken from the ID or the OD? I'm having a debate with a coworker on the proper procedure. Any help is appreciated.
: .
.



 
08:56 Dec-03-2004
mohammad
new version(iso 4386) hello
i need a new version iso 4386
thank you


 
03:28 Mar-18-2006
RAMON CARO FABELA
new version(iso 4386) ----------- Start Original Message -----------
: Hi
: i need a new version iso 4386
because,because at the moment I do not have this norm ( ISO 4386 )
: thank you
------------ End Original Message ------------




 
10:51 Jan-06-2011

hepy

Engineering
Indonesia,
Joined Jan 2011
1
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Csaba Hollo at 07:39 Apr-23-2003 .

guys, I have an issue. In ISO 4386-1, basically there are 2 methods that we can apply to check the bonding of the babbitt; with backwall echo and without backwall echo.
Here, the inspection using without backwall echo is more applicable. If we use this method, the standard says that the bond is good if the first bond echo is less than reference echo. Bond is bad if the first bond echo is equal or higher than reference echo.
I had a case, when we inspected one bearing, it was visually seen from the side face the babbitt was delaminated. Uniquely, when we checked by UT, the bond echo is less than the reference echo, it’s about half. According to standard, this should be good bond.
Can anyone advise what did we do wrong?

 
15:28 Jan-06-2011

Tom Nelligan

Engineering,
retired,
USA,
Joined Nov 1998
390
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Sonya Fedoruk at 07:17 Apr-23-2003 (Opening).

We usually suggest that our customers try a phase-based test from the babbit side, as mentioned above by Mr. Hollo. The basic procedure is described in the application note at the link below. In the case of smaller bearings, with an inside diameter of less than approximately 250 mm, a radiused delay line transducer is used to maintain proper coupling on the curved surface.

http://www.olympus-ims.com/en/ndt-application/183-id.209715240.html

 
16:45 Jan-06-2011

Lalit Mohan Kothari

Consultant, -
On ..IOCL and BARC(Bhabha Atomic Research Centre).etc,
India,
Joined Jan 2003
128
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Sonya Fedoruk at 07:17 Apr-23-2003 (Opening).

Sonya ,
!.
1.A stepped test block of the same composition of white metals to be used for calibration.
2.Prove frequency generally is 4MHZ can higher if thinner the lining. For good resolution.
3.For interface echo in area of good bonding at the junction of white metal and its backing .The energy of the echo depends upon the acoustic mismatch of materials .
The values .
White metal/steel -28%
White metal/Cast Iron -14%
White metal/Brass -10%
White metal/Leaded Gunmetal -25%
Good bond means if interface echo is less then above value and
When back echo from backing metal is with or with out interface echo.

No bond when echo exceed near about back echo .
When multiple interface echoes observed.

Acceptance varies with the use of bearing and its size like Thrust ,Guide pads, turbine, generator and motors. And whether lack of bonding in loading area or top half of bearing.
If defect please also consider it
For more please visit ASME.ORG
Thanks &Regard

 
20:05 Jan-07-2011

Manuel Haces

Director, - Wire rope inspection
Haces Inspección del Noreste and Wire Rope Inspection,
Mexico,
Joined Jun 2002
117
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Sonya Fedoruk at 07:17 Apr-23-2003 (Opening).

We measure the delamited area versus total area of bearing with babbit, the client decide reject according to our results and his requeriments. Regards.

 
04:34 Jan-14-2011

Thananon Advanced UT

Engineering
WIT,
Thailand,
Joined Apr 2004
3
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Manuel Haces at 20:05 Jan-07-2011 .

Dear Sir

If you need ISO 4386 part 1 for Babbit inspection by UT,
please send email to me then I will send this specification to you.
When you check babbit after repair do not mind only delamination but must to look for defect after repair which depen on the process reparing.
The interpretation for delamination area please refer to Acoustic Impedance Theory.

Thananon
Advacned UT from Thailand

 
04:53 Aug-30-2012
Marsito
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Sonya Fedoruk at 07:17 Apr-23-2003 (Opening).

Standart Exaination Babbit Bearing

 
08:51 Aug-30-2012
wirya wijaya
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Thananon Advanced UT at 04:34 Jan-14-2011 .

I need ISO 4386 part 1 for Babbit inspection by UT, please sent to me by email "rikimaru_wi@yahoo.com" or free download to website addres.

Thank's & Regards.
Wirya

 
20:26 Sep-04-2012

Csaba Hollo

, Senior Technician
Acuren Group Inc.,
Canada,
Joined Feb 2010
301
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to hepy at 10:51 Jan-06-2011 .

The key issue with making either procedure work is by making sure that you are using the correct amount of gain.

This examination is based on scanning from the babbit face. I can safely say that I never use the backwall method, simply because the configuration of most bearings do no have predictable parallel faces to the examination surface.

When using the ISO multi echo technique, The idea is to get the interface response to a percentage of screen height. I use 50%, and take care to keep my coupling constant. Any significant increase in gain, followed by a multiple echoes from the interface signifies a disbond. The drawback is that you must observe much more of the screen content while scanning...looking for the gain to increase, and multiple echoes to show. Mapping is also a bit more cumbersome.

The reason I prefer the phase reversal technique, is because the disbond areas are more easily distinguished from the bonded areas, and all I use for a calibration block is a standard steel step block. I just look at the response from the step reflector on the step block, and that is my disbond response. A reflector at the interface at a lower gain setting and opposite in phase (and delayed by half the waveform) is a bonded area. Simple. This technique also works in the dovetail machined grooves, whereas ISO method recognizes the difficulty in resolving disbonds in these areas due to the limitations on the display

No need for special blocks made with disbonds, or white metal blocks with specific compositions matching the babbit material in order to set up the velocity...because it just doesn't matter. The key is identifying you interface echo, knowing what a disbond waveform looks with respect to phase, adjusting your gain to make it consistent, and you are ready to go.

 
16:12 Sep-28-2012
ganesh bhoir
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Sonya Fedoruk at 07:17 Apr-23-2003 (Opening).

Generaton Bearing UT testin Procedure,
Use Of material bebbit & Returning ring UT testin .Procedure
Use of material Mn 18 manganese & 18 Chromium send immedetly.

 
19:59 Oct-01-2012

Csaba Hollo

, Senior Technician
Acuren Group Inc.,
Canada,
Joined Feb 2010
301
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to ganesh bhoir at 16:12 Sep-28-2012 .

Ganesh and others,

Please do not ask or demand that people send you copies of codes or specifications that have cost money to purchase. It is in bad taste, and will generally be ignored.

As far as asking for procedures, most of the people on this site will be happy to share knowledge with you, but are not likely to release documentation that may possibly be proprietary, or have significant time and development invested.

My suggestion is to invest the 66 swiss francs and get an authorized copy of the ISO 4386-1 standard. Then download the application document Tom Nelligan alluded to from the Olympus website. With these two documents, anyone with some Ultrasonic testing expertise should be able to come up with a procedure.

 
11:54 Apr-22-2014

jaimin patel

NDT Inspector, NDT LeveL-III @ UIC, KSA
Saudi Arabia,
Joined Dec 2012
98
Re: Ultrasonic Procedure of Babbit Bearings In Reply to Csaba Hollo at 19:59 Oct-01-2012 .

what is the difference between cladding done as per asme and bonding?.

will we use asme section v clading calibration block of technique one for code for that babbit bearing?

 


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